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Best Method for Tissue to Tissue Bonding (Read 309 times)
Reply #14 - Today at 9:12am

alfakilo   Offline

Retired USAF and TWA.
St Louis, MO

Posts: 14
 
LASTWOODSMAN wrote Today at 7:40am:
Hi AK - you say that your "construction results show glue residue at the joints". 
Richard


I think the main thing is that I haven't been trimming or removing the 'flash' as well as others have. For example, the previous comment about using a plastic pic to remove excess glue before the glue sets up/dries. I've never thought of that! I just need to clean up my act!!

It seems to me that trimming away any CA flash is more difficult than Sig-Ment or resin glues.

Another tip that I've gathered from reading these forums is that I need to make a better fitting joint to minimize gaps. This plus removing excess flash should help a lot.


 
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Reply #13 - Today at 7:40am

LASTWOODSMAN   Offline
Senior Member
REAL PLANES HAD ROUND
ENGINES AND TWO WINGS
Windsor, Ontario, Canada

Posts: 1130
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Hi AK - you say that your "construction results show glue residue at the joints".  Please post a pic or three that shows us what that looks like, and tell us what kind of glue you used.  Then that should narrow the question.   Wink
LWM
Richard
 

OH, I HAVE SLIPPED THE SURLY BONDS OF EARTH ... UP, UP THE LONG DELIRIOUS BURNING BLUE ... SUNWARD I'VE CLIMBED AND JOINED THE TUMBLING MIRTH OF SUN-SPLIT CLOUDS ...
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Reply #12 - Today at 7:02am

New Builder   Offline
Senior Member
Amherstburg, Ontario, Canada

Posts: 326
****
 
AK - The glue type is a question that has multiple answers and I'm sure there will be several replies here ranging from CA to Aliphatic Resins (Titebond, etc.) . If you want a longer dialog go to Hip Pocket Aeronautics www.hippocketaeronautics.com and enter thru the home page using the "Builders Forum" button. Once there use the search window at the top right of the page and enter just the word glue, press enter and happy reading.
New Builder
Mike
 
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Reply #11 - Yesterday at 3:16pm

alfakilo   Offline

Retired USAF and TWA.
St Louis, MO

Posts: 14
 
New Builder wrote Yesterday at 2:42pm:
AK - I use a plastic dental pic to remove the glue fillets before it dries, nothing sticks to it. Not my original thought, saw it here in S&T.
New Builder
Mike


Type of glue? I've never thought of this technique before, thanks for the tip!
 
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Reply #10 - Yesterday at 2:42pm

New Builder   Offline
Senior Member
Amherstburg, Ontario, Canada

Posts: 326
****
 
AK - I use a plastic dental pic to remove the glue fillets before it dries, nothing sticks to it. Not my original thought, saw it here in S&T.
New Builder
Mike
 
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Reply #9 - Yesterday at 9:56am

alfakilo   Offline

Retired USAF and TWA.
St Louis, MO

Posts: 14
 
I really like the Vanguard pictures! One thing I saw immediately...my construction results show glue residue at the joints, but in these pictures, I see very little. What type of glue was used? And how?
 
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Reply #8 - Jan 12th, 2018 at 7:04pm

scigs30   Offline
Junior Member
I Love YaBB 2.5 AE!
San diego

Posts: 89
**
 
Trust me, I still like and use Nitrate dopes, but Eze Dope does work as well but does take practice.
 
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Reply #7 - Jan 12th, 2018 at 9:23am

New Builder   Offline
Senior Member
Amherstburg, Ontario, Canada

Posts: 326
****
 
Sciggs - Thank you for the link and is a great conversation and happy that there has been success out there. My reading suggests that most builders are not using Eze Dope mostly, and I'm guessing here, the acrylic nature (water based) and having  past success with nitrate and, if it's working why change. I agree with this scenario as I'm a bit of an old timer and hang onto my past success as well but nitrate and I are just not compatible. So, thank you again for the links and the great conversation.
New Builder
Mike
 
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Reply #6 - Jan 10th, 2018 at 5:49pm

scigs30   Offline
Junior Member
I Love YaBB 2.5 AE!
San diego

Posts: 89
**
 
I thinned it in the bottle and brushed it on. I tried airbrushing once but was a pain to clean.
 
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Reply #5 - Jan 10th, 2018 at 11:21am

Sky9pilot   Offline
Administrator
Stick & Tissue
Kelso, WA 98626 USA

Posts: 8713
*****
 
Sciggs...great links and fantastic models.  I envy your covering skills.  It looks like you work with EzeDope straight out of the bottle for trim work and then thinned EzeDope for sealing and shrinking. In your link you mention spraying the thinned EzeDope.  Is that through your airbrush or spritzed with an atomizer bottle/hairspray bottle?  Again, your work is inspiring!
Tom
 

If God is your Co-pilot...switch seats...
Your attitude will determine your altitude!- John Maxwell
And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall set you free. Jn 8:32
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Reply #4 - Jan 10th, 2018 at 8:11am

scigs30   Offline
Junior Member
I Love YaBB 2.5 AE!
San diego

Posts: 89
**
 
 
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Reply #3 - Jan 2nd, 2018 at 2:50pm

New Builder   Offline
Senior Member
Amherstburg, Ontario, Canada

Posts: 326
****
 
Hi Mike - Thank you for the reply and all makes perfect sense to me, only problem is that I don't use dope in the traditional sense but rather Eze Dope due mostly to the smell causing some breathing irritation and the fact it is right now (3:30 PM Eastern) 22 degrees in my workshop. I've been doing tissue trials with Eze Dope and having great success with attaching tissue to tissue with UHU Blue over Eze but no success in releasing the Eze to move any tissue. I'll try the clear as there will be a supply run in the very near future. Next thing to try is splicing tissue using EzeDope. I'm thinking that with the acrylic nature of the dope, I may be able to place one tissue over the other and dope through to make the joint, I'll know soon. The small amount of success I've been having is beginning to show that I may just need to make a trip to the U.S. and visit Volare and stock up on Esaki tissue. Wife is making noises that she wants to go shopping so may be sooner than later. As a fall back, I can always go to my airbrush and frisket paper. None the less, I greatly appreciate yours and everybody on this site for the  help and direction, makes me glad I belong here.
Mike
 
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Reply #2 - Jan 1st, 2018 at 9:24pm

MKelly   Offline
Senior Member
Helotes, TX

Posts: 303
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I've used a couple of techniques for putting tissue on tissue.

With glue stick, I've used both Elmer's purple and UHU clear.  I like the UHU clear a bit better.  I just put a schmear on the trim piece, then put one edge down, align best I can, then press the rest down.  If it's not right, you can release the glue using a q-tip dampened with rubbing alcohol.  Dope (or apply your preferred sealant) over the part to seal on the markings.

A word of warning - I used this technique to put the black tissue letters on the silver esaki covering my Navion.  Several weeks passed between applying the markings and doping the model, and the glue stick released in several areas resulting in the markings lifting and warping a bit.  Alcohol stuck them back down, but close examination shows some residual bubbling.  I'd recommend doping within a day of applying the markings.

I've had very good results using thinner to position tissue markings over doped tissue.  Dope your parts, then whenever you're ready to apply markings just place them in position and touch the edges with a brush wetted with dope thinner.  The thinner flows under the marking, sucking it down to the surface nicely.  The paintbrush can be used to push or pull the marking into alignment as required, and the thinner will dissolve just enough dope from the surface to hold the marking in position.  Once you're satisfied with position brush a fresh coat of dope over the marking area to seal everything down.

For splicing tissue together, just align with a slight overlap (at least 1/32"), dope the joint, let dry, flip over, and dope the other side of the joint.  After it's dry you can use it just like you would a single piece of tissue.

Hope this helps, let me know if any of it doesn't make sense to you.

Mike
 
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Reply #1 - Dec 31st, 2017 at 5:55pm

Sky9pilot   Offline
Administrator
Stick & Tissue
Kelso, WA 98626 USA

Posts: 8713
*****
 
Need a bit more information on the type of bonding you're doing.  If your gluing tissue to tissue like Mike in his F7F Tigercat firebomber: then you're talking different than applying tissue over shrunken tissue on a model already covered with the base layer. 

Mike used dope to attach the edges, and if I remember correctly he doped one of the edges first and let it dry
see Mike's clarification in next post
then doped the connecting tissue and used some thinner to attach to each other  then let that dry before applying to the model.  Then the tissue was applied as one piece to the model making sure to carefully align the pattern correctly on the balsa structure.

On my Spitfire Tutorial of applying green camo over the earth tone base tissue I did this with glue stick after the base tissue was wetted and then allowed to shrink as it dried.  Once dried the pattern was attached to the base tissue by using glue stick on the bottom of the camo pattern and then attached by placing the camo pattern on the proper location and then smoothed down from the middle of the pattern to the edges.   Once that was smoothed completely and the rest of the camo was applied another spritzing was applied and allowed to dry and shrink again. 

I used tweezers to help gently lift tissue and tug it into place as I smoothed the tissue.  Again working from the middle to the edges of the pattern.

Hope you find this helpful.  If not re-ask with more details of what you need info wise!

You also might want to check the "Tissue and Finish" board for some ideas: Click Here
Tom
« Last Edit: Jan 2nd, 2018 at 11:00am by Sky9pilot »  

If God is your Co-pilot...switch seats...
Your attitude will determine your altitude!- John Maxwell
And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall set you free. Jn 8:32
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Dec 31st, 2017 at 7:32am

New Builder   Offline
Senior Member
Amherstburg, Ontario, Canada

Posts: 326
****
 
I've watched and seen folks on this site bond tissue to tissue for markings and trim work and seems most folks use Uhu Blue. My trials with tissue to tissue have proven a bit futile due to the instant grab of the glue, repositioning to remove wrinkles usually tears the original tissue. Any bits of information will be greatly appreciated.
 
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