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Dave L
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Re: Flight videos of crosswind kite models
Reply #5 - Jun 10th, 2012 at 9:22am
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Thanks for your interest, Charlieman. 

I land the kites by flying into the wind until it slows down.  I try to get it close to the ground, and as it slows it flips upright and glides a little until it lands on its belly.  It's pretty safe.

Crosswind refers to exactly what you describe with reference to maximum power being available at 90 degrees to the wind. I borrowed the term from my dad's article on power generation with kites, Crosswind Kite Power.

Yes, I've thought that a bellcrank to the rudder would work for kites like this. My dad and I used rudder and dihedral to control 5 foot span RC kites of this type.  It worked much better than ailerons.  I expect that a rudder / dihedral kite would make a good trainer because the lines could get more slack and still provide some control, so it could be flown overhead in one spot more easily the type I'm flying, where you have to keep it flying fast to maintain line tension and control. Having the alternative of "parking" it would allow beginning flyers to ease into figure eights and back to overhead.

If you flew control line, you should try one of these!  They are easy to fly if you have that experience.
  
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Charlieman
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Re: Flight videos of crosswind kite models
Reply #4 - Jun 9th, 2012 at 10:00am
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Not sure term "crosswind" is correct for this tpe of flying. wouldn't "into the wind" be more appropo? But is VERY intriquing! and I guess you can call it what you want Wink

Some of us that flew CL back in 50's and 60's discovered that on high wind days, our Ringmasters and other stunters could continue flying variations of a figure 8 and loops just as you're doing in the video. Of course our models were oriented  with the lines (60ft) coming out the wing tip and we controlled with the elevator. IIRC we could navigate about a 1/4 of the hemispere with relative ease. A bit more if momentum was managed carefully.

Also IIRC, there was a purpose built CL glider that used the  principle in Model Builder magazine back in the 80's. Catapult launch??!!

I suspect that with your configuration/orientation, a standard type bellcrank linked to rudder would also work. However I like your simple banking control.  Great to see some inovative thinking put into practice!

How do you land the kite model? I suspect in a steady wind by pulling in the line?

Advantage to windmilling CL is model can be landed on its gear or bellied in.

I've always been intrigued with the areodynamics common to kites, wings, and sails. When sailing, the craft reaches its fasted when crossing the wind at 90 deg., same with the CL models and suspect same with your kite model.

Thanks for sharing.
  
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Sky9pilot
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Re: Flight videos of crosswind kite models
Reply #3 - May 15th, 2012 at 7:58am
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Interesting thought Dave....


I'm sure the engine would have an effect with decalage because of the affect of the prop blast.  I'll let some else test that theory.... Grin Wink Cool

Tom

  

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Your attitude will determine your altitude!- John Maxwell
And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall set you free. Jn 8:32
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Dave L
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Re: Flight videos of crosswind kite models
Reply #2 - May 14th, 2012 at 10:47pm
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Thanks you guys for creating a little corner for my various posts.  Should be easier for someone wondering what this kite stuff is about to check it out.

Tom,

I'm glad to hear you flew control line at an early age!  That should help, if you want to fly a model as a kite.  Since I also flew control line at about the same age, I hold the handle just like that, vertically.  And yes, you don't get dizzy.  But unless you've flown dual-line kites a bit, it may take some getting used to the flight window power zone and peripheral areas.  It's kind of weird to have the area you fly through determine how much power your plane has, but that's how it is. 

No, the planes don't need any movable surfaces, wires, bellcranks or any other control line stuff, except lines, of course.  In fact, I have a hunch that is so far untested, that no one ever needed those moveable controls because we could have set up control line planes to fly just like these kites do:  attach the lines to the bottom of the wing so when you pull on one line it banks the plane one way and you pull the other to bank the other way, then hang a motor on the front to pull it around.  Not a kite anymore, it's a power plane!  What would be cool about this approach is that the whole wing is lifting the plane toward the out side of the circle, keeping the lines taut, unlike control line, where that is done by centrifugal force and very slight rudder/body lift.  The result:  you could fly on much longer lines with a huge hemisphere to maneuver in.  This would be really fun for combat!  I haven't tried it because I'm not really into motors, but I should grab an .049 and put it on one of my kites to see what happens.  The decalage might not be right because you probably don't need a plane with a motor flying around at maximum lift all the time, but we'll never know until someone tries it!

Dave
  
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Sky9pilot
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Re: Flight videos of crosswind kite models
Reply #1 - May 13th, 2012 at 8:46pm
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Thanks for posting the links for these videos Dave...

Really reminds me of CL (Control Line) flying but no danger of getting dizzy flying in a circle. Haven't done any CL flying since Jr. Hi.  years....that was just after Columbus landed on the east coast... Grin Grin Grin

Do you change direction by pulling the handle like CL (like up and down elevator)?  Not sure yet in my thinking just how this works to change direction.  From looking at you planes in the hanger section I didn't see any movable surfaces on the elevator or rudder.  This really looks like fun. 

Keep us appraised on what you're doing next Dave. Shocked Grin Wink Cool

Tom
  

If God is your Co-pilot...switch seats...
Your attitude will determine your altitude!- John Maxwell
And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall set you free. Jn 8:32
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Dave L
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Flight videos of crosswind kite models
May 13th, 2012 at 8:29pm
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I have a few flight videos of the series 400 Guillow's warbird crosswind kites here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K-3HxYKulc4
  
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